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 Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades

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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Fri Dec 04, 2009 6:01 am

P26

Oct 04, 2009

Removing Fuel Tank Sump Assembly


I dont want to appear to be job hopping here, but that this had been a job to do when the fuel nearly ran out, I took the car for a run over to Swinsty Reservoir near Blubberhouses yesterday for those of you who know the area. Only problems was on the way back I was having a bit of fun with a Porsche 4S and got to Skipton and realised my petrol light was on Embarassed So I had to stop and put a £5 of petrol in to get me home not the plan but anyway got home and still some petrol in. Sad

First job was to move the drain bolt 9\16 which came out very easily, to my amazement there was still a lot in there but there was plenty of muck in the petrol. Exclamation



Next I took a 13\16 socket and undid the sump assembly this had a brass ring round the top but no seal was there, did the early models have a seal Question

Heres a birdseye veiw inside, no wonder its been stuttering Embarassed



Out on a flat surface, spiders an' all



Am I right in thinking this is the filter at the bottom of the fuel filter Question



To me it looks ok so I wont need to remove the boot lining and take the filter out from the top Question

As the sump assembly was off and looked a bit tatty I thought Id rub it down and re underseal it Idea



Chipped the old sealant off and rubbed down



Before anyone asks no there not my Tinkled Pink Wellies Laughing

First coat of Underseal applied



Advice

The filter looks ok, but don't forget the gasket when you put the brass sump back Exclamation

Oct 08, 2009

Carburettor Question


On starting the E I am finding that I have to rev it quite a bit not heavily but on start up it wont really tick over on its own for a couple of minutes with out bottoming out
When driving and in traffic its fine, and if out I stop and restart the car its fine. Its just an issue when cold .

When End of an Era Im sure I remember it saying its a problem with balancing

Is it time to get it booked in for a carb rebuild over the winter or is it just a case of tunning and replace any worn parts

Advice

You need to check the operation of the choke. From cold you will use full choke for the first 5 minutes or so and then gradually reduce it as the engine reaches normal temperature (usually 10 minutes). Doubt you will need the carbs re-built after so few miles, just a tune up. Although it seems daunting from reading the manual a tune up is not that difficult. In your case just play around with the choke and fast running adjustments, leave the rest alone.

Oct 09, 2009

Axle Ratio

Due to my parts not arriving this week, Ive been on other jobs, underealing arches and working through to the front of the car.

This afternoon I had a go at the rear axle drain\ filler bolts again , finally got the filling one off but still no joy with the drainning one least I can now fill it to the correct level

When under the car car I noticed a tab on the rear axle 43\14

What ratio does this mean my rear axle is Question

Advice

3.07 = 43 divided by 14

----

The 43 is the number of crownwheel teeth, and the 14 is the pinion teeth.What is interesting is that the standard ratio for 3.8s in UK was 3.31 and the 3.07 final drive only really started to be fitted to 3.8s in any quantity in about 1964 , shortly before the introduction of the 4.2 , and about the same time that the all synchro box also started to creep in to 3.8s. This suggests that you have a later rear end, unless your heritage cert shows that it was a special order Question Heritage Certificate not got yet to confirm Exclamation

----

Having done a bit more research it appears that some 1963 cars had the 3.07 axle in the UK - Autocar tested one in April 1963. I may be wrong about the 4 synchro box although there are quite a number of 3.8s around with them but they may have been retrofitted

Oct 10, 2009

Back Axle


Re the back axle - I actually have the original registration document and mine was 1st registered 25\09\1962, so it was either one of the first to have a 3.07 axle or perhaps it was an extra, or the axle was changed at the restore circ. '78 - '81. I know the axle was rebuilt at the restore.

I got the filler plug out, still no joy with the drain plug. After topping up with a litre of oil I put a new filler plug in, strangley enough personalised for me. Very Happy



Re the stutter \ spluttering my seal arrived this morning so I put it all back together, filtered the tub of petrol back in, started it first time on full choke and it ticked over fine.

Took her out for a spin and on acceleration its still stuttering and back firing, the carburettor piston dampers had been checked for oil before setting off so that wasnt the cause. On researching during the week I read this can be caused by the coil Also I was gonna give the plugs a quick check, but they are nearly new so should be fine, any other items to check appreciated.

I was going to order a new coil next week, I was going to go for a flame thrower but again in the week read a negative article about them that put me off, so veiws on the best coil for the car appreciated...

Advice

Check the numbers on your speedo - they will tell you what diff it is matched with. They are also stamped on the body so you should have an idea if it is the original.

Re coil. I have a flamethrower fitted (used one on the last car) and have not had any problems - mind you, haven't had one for years either. FWIW, I eliminated my misfire by fitting a 123 distributor. Transformed the car.


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Fri Dec 04, 2009 8:46 am

P27

Oct 10, 2009

Bonnet Landing Rubbers


Quick swap out nothing difficult

Before



After




Oct 11, 2009

123Ignitions & Coils


Obviously, I'll RTFM when I gety my 123ignition, but I just wondered what curve the 123\JAG-6-R-V Distributor is set set to on a 3.8 or are they all different Question

On the forum Ive read one was set to 7 and then I just read another and it said 5.

http://www.123ignition.nl/forum/

Also, how to I check if my car is posotive or negative earth
sorry if its a basic question... Embarassed

Advice

The only design flaw with the 123 is you have to remove it from the car to change the advance curve so it is best to choose one and stick with it. None of the supplied curves match the Jaguar dizzy as far as I can see but some are a close approximation.

All negative earth cars should have a large yellow notice on the heater box stating the fact. The 3.8 cars were all designed for positive earth, the 4.2 cars were negative earth. If you car still has a dynamo then it will almost certainly be +ve earth, if it has an alternator fitted then it will be -ve earth. Easiest way to check is to follow the earth lead on the battery - whichever terminal it is connected to will deterime the polarity. My guess is your car will be positive earth.


Mine has a Dynamo = +ve earth

Earthing the Engine

Advice


Before you spend a lot on more ignition parts, check that your engine is properly earthed . Somewhere, usually from one of the bellhousing bolts, there should be a copper braided lead which bolts at its other end onto part of the frame ( often near the torsion bar mounts). If this is missing - and it's amazing how often they are - it can cause intermittent misfiring. It can also have other unpleasant effects as a result of what are called sneak currents, ( e.g. earthing only through the speedo cable which is highly undesirable) and thus is worth checking out anyway Idea

----

A broken or loose earth strap will make your choke cable get really hot when the starter is engaged.

----

Just to pick up on the need for a good earth, this can be the cause of many problems, especially starting. In addition to the copper braided earth from the body to the block that Christopher mentions, I have run an additional earth wire, (of the same thick round copper cored wire that earths the battery to the body point), direct from the battery Earth terminal to the engine block by the dipstick. This passes through the gap between the torsion bar and the body with enough slack for the engine movement. This provides a direct earth to the block and greatly improves the starter motor cranking speed.
Sometimes people spend a fortune on a new starter motor believing this to be the problem with their slow cranking speed, only to find a simple additional earth - which only costs a couple of pounds to make and fitted in ten minutes - sorts the problem and several other running issues. A good earth is essential
Exclamation

Oct 14, 2009

Front ARB Bushes


While I was undersealing I did a couple of other jobs which were in desperate need, I changed the bonnet springs, drilled out the old split pins out as they were stuck with underseal. Sad

Put the new new springs on and new pins bonnet now opens a treat and stays there smoker

Changed the front ARB bushes, god what a job getting some old bolts out rusted and painted over swear

So heres some pics OS

Before



During



After - see the new springs & braided hoses he he



Then the NS was even harder to get the bolts out

Before -It looked like a drunken tart had been down there with the Red Paint again swear



After



Can you tell the difference Question

Previously there wasnt even any plates on the ARB spacers

The actual ARB needs a strip down and refurb but I'll do that when I change the Coolant Hoses and I cant do that till me POR 15 arrives to seal my tanks at the same time.

Back to the suspension parts, least its looking a bit better down there, Im graduallly geting my front suspension rebuild parts together and as I do it I'll respray as and where the parts need it, as for the guy who was given a tin of red paint and a paint brush Id really like to meet him swear you know what I mean Wink

Not sure what happened or didnt happen with the front of the frame when the car was resprayed as theres a lot of evidence of Opalesent Silver Blue down there its original colour.

Oct 21, 2009

Erattic Misfire

Ive recently been contacted by a less active member of the forum than myself Geoff who is doing a restore and it turned out after reading my postings he works quite near me so after a lot of pictures and emails pinging back and forth we met up last night and Geoff offered to assist me with sourcing my problem.

So after some and a good chat we went out to the car.

I asked Geoff to go through what he did as I didnt have any knowledge of points etc.

This is roughly what was done :-

Visual check - was everthing there and in the right place Smile
Checked all HT Leads and king lead - all seemed to be in firm Smile
Removed distributor cap - visual check - no cracks Smile
Removed Lucas Rotar Arm - Good condition except sight arcing Smile
Condensor- Visual check looks like new Smile

So far so good

Then I moved the car forward slightly so the heel (moving contact) on the points came into contact with one of the edges of the Cam. It could be seen that there was hardly a gap in the contact breaker points. Sad

Geoff taught me how to reset the gap in the points. Smile

(If anyone wants to look it up, its about P104 Haynes manual)

The gap was reset to 0.015inch. Smile

While the cap was off I gave the Cam a slight grese which prevents the heel from wearing. Also I put a couple of drops of oil on the rotar arm spindle centre sponge. Smile

On starting the car it did tick over a lot better.

Earth Straps

A couple of you guys have mentioned the ES so I bought a couple at Stoneleigh on Sunday just in case. On checking for these Geoff found one on the + side of the battery which was attached to the front of the moncoque body (bulkhead) Geoff advised also that another was required so thats a job for another day at least it has one at the moment though

Test Drive

On taking her out today firstly she ticks over so much better as normally when reversing out I am contantly feathering the accelerator but today she just rolled down the drive ticking over happily Exclamation Smile

As for the intermitent\ erratic misfire it is still there

Suggestions Guys ....

Advice

Have you tried a new coil? e.g. Lucas Sport - http://tinyurl.com/ogljd3

I seem to recall you have new HT leads and plugs so may as well spring for the coil. It could also be a worn distributor or weak advance springs. Next step will be to replace the dizzy, with a 123. Unfortunately with this sort of fault sequential replacement of parts is the easiest option

Does the misfire occur when you slowly rev the engine at standstill?


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Sat Dec 05, 2009 7:29 am

P28

Advice


Irrattic Missfire Cont.


Whooooa ..... we've only just begun to go through the basics here ...there's plenty more fundamentals to check ...coil, rotor arm, condensor, internal earth wire onto points mounting plate, dizzy cap, and all the individual electrical connections to these items ...all of which can be checked by swapping out one by one & testing again .

Throwing money at this by buying a 123 won't neccessarily solve the problem...indeed a 123 requires a very sound basic set-up before it will run at all .

Save the eye candy for when the engine is ok ...then the 123 will improve it.

Next time we can incrementally swap the coil, rotor arm, dizzy cap & check the flexible internal dizzy earth wire.

Geoff


Oct 21, 2009

It is very intermitent but usual happens between 60 -70 mph although today it happen while accelerating off from some lights Not aggresively just normally.

Not put a new coil in yet, yep leads and plugs are new.

Personally I would like to resolve the issue efore putting a 123 in if possible.

I'll get a coil and condensor ordered and check those Exclamation

Advice Engine Earth Strap

Can we return to the engine earth strap. The engine is largely insulated from the body ( which carries the earth connected to the battery +ve terminal) by the 3 rubber mountings. This is why it needs a strap to connect its metal directly to the body. Without that strap the engine is not properly earthed and this is a common source of misfiring

The strange thing is though if it is related to the ES the car in my ownership was driven for 400miles with no misfire, then it has developed scratch

More Advice Engine Earth Strap

Just because it has an earth strap it does not mean it has zero resistance contact. Could be a loose bolt or corrosion which is causing the problem. So locate the engine earth strap, remove and clean the contact areas and replace securely. Or, in the interests of diagnosing the problem, attach a temporary wire between engine and the battery earth. Take the car for a run and see what happens.

----

If you have any decent jump leads take one from the battery +ve straight to the engine ...plenty of good bolt heads in the area we looked at ...& go for another test drive ...if ithat cures it then a longer earth strap than the Stonleigh ones will do it.

Just make sure the lead is mechanically secure & won't drop off during the drive ...for obvious reasons !

Geoff


Earth Strap -Test Drive

Oct 22, 2009

So I connected one end of the jump lead to the battery +ve and the other to the bolt head above where the other ES is connected. I then looped the excess wire and secured it to the washer bottle bracket.

Once I got to the main road a few hundred yards down it and it did again, after driving a while and getting to the required speed ( traffic) I noticed it wasnt doing it as much but it was still there, on the way home I did stop and pop the bonnet to check all was secure Idea


So I think an additional ES is helping the problem but hasnt solved it.

I went this morning to get a coil and they were out of stock till tomorrow, I knew I should of rang first to check they had them in So I'll try the coil and condenser tommorrow. It would be nice to have it sorted for Saturday as going to car Chorley then Congelton in it

The old ES looks fine, all on secure etc. Very Happy

Advice

Your problem is unlikely to be earthing then so coil is the next step. I wonder whether you should check the fuel pressure (it needs to be around 2psi or higher).

Erattic Misfire - Resolved

After having no joy getting a coil from MiniSort in Padiham, I gave Hutsons a ring but they said due to the postage strike it wouldnt be with me for a about a week

On speaking with Geoff he said he had a load of reliable spares in his playroom, sorry garage
Anyway Geoff dropped these off on the way to the office today Smile

I first swaped the coil, and took the rotar arm, and dizzy cap with me and I'd swap them out on the road side and see what differences the various parts swapped out made.

After swapping the coil out I got out onto the main road and got stuck in slow moving traffic, Sad once past Whalley it was fine and I could test the car in the relevant range accelerating through 60-70 mph all seemed fine Smile

Anyway I did a U turn at the Sabden turn off and gave her a good airing on the way back, over taking all the repmobiles without a stutter

Once again a Big to eveyone who has helped with resolving this simple annoying problem.

Oct 26, 2009

Silent Horn
So taking a step back before the misfire, it seems I was working on a faulty Horn (p25) and I had just been advised to do the following checks. 1-6

I will get back to you with my results.

Horn Advice

I'm a little puzzled about "brown wires" here ...E-type convention is that brown wires are permanent unswitched, unfused feeds from the -ve battery terminal (assuming 3.8 +ve earth vehicle as is yours)...there are no brown wires directly connected to the horns.

Earthing a brown wire will normally turn your battery into an arc welder Shocked

If we apply the classic half-split technique to this you should locate the Purple / Black tracer wire connecting terminal w2 on the horn relay ( found mounted on the n/s front mud deflector) to the oversize bullet terminal under the steering column.

If, upon earthing this wire , the horns sound then the relay & the horns are fine & the fault is in the column / horn push.

If the horns don't sound then you need to get that bit working first before tackling the column innards

Geoff


----

Im not an electrician but its looking more like the column to me and I think Ive read you can get a horn repair kit to replace certain parts within the column

Advice

Hmmmm ...sounds like a P O has been in there and done some rewiring . I've just looked at your previous photos & see what you mean. It must be an additional wire as there aren't any brown wires in the original loom at that point....I'll recheck on mine later today & confirm that to you.

Can you see what colour wire is connected to w2 on the relay ? If it is a purple / black tracer it would then be worth doing a continuity check with your meter back to the other end of the wire under the column. Ditto the brown wire if w2 is brown.

It could be that the relay has been wired out & the horns connected directly .... which would not do the column contacts any good as the horns draw a high current when energised ...hence the relay.

Anyway you need to delve further to understand what, if any butchery, has been committed. I agree it sounds as though the column contacts are at fault now but unless you verify that the relay is in circuit & wired correctly , replacing the column contacts will work for a while & then the high current will burn 'em out again.

Geoff


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:01 am

P29

Oct 27, 2009

Horny Problem Cont.


I can confirm there are 4 wires on the relay and position W2 is purple /black.

Did a check on it turned ignition on but didnt start, pressed the horn no beep from MM or horn

Advice

Ok ...we're beginning to understand that some re-wiring has taken place at the hands of a Previous Owner (P O's take all the blame !)

I've just checked under mine ...there aren't any brown wires in that part of the loom near the column.

Staying at the relay & connecting the red probe of your meter to chassis & using your black probe for testing you should find that :-
* w1 has a green wire to it from fuse 6....this should have -12v with respect to chassis only when the ignition is turned on.
* c1 has a purple / yellow tracer to it from pin 4 of the bonnet connector ...this is the main feed to the horns which should be in the undertray of the bonnet . If the horns are elsewhere it's odds on that the wiring is now non-standard.
* c2 has a brown / purple tracer wire to it from fuse 3 ...caution this will be at -12v with respect to chassis at all times !

Can you check that the wires & voltages are present .

If they are then earth terminal w2 to pull in the relay ...you should hear it click .... and check for the presence of -12v at c1 only when w2 is earthed.

Check back in at that point & we'll see what you've found ... sorry if this sounds like disabling a wartime bomb ...but the priciple is the same !!

Geoff




----

Also the horns have been relocated there on the top picture frame bar behind the radiator shroud.

Oh and one more thing the wires to the relay:-

1) We have a spare dangling wire -this has a woven sleeve and I did pull that back for more clues but it was black underneath - This is deffinatly something to do with the horn because if you unplug the other one like it, plug it in C2 the horn sounds continuously


2) C2 - also (woven sleeve etc)

3) W1 - It was green we have a correct wire (P1 thread, Picture behind dash) 3 green wires going into fuse 6 green wire from relay heads back that way

4) C1 - Was a brown wire - The horns do have brown wires going into the top - coming from C1 -This looks correct

I think it would be SAFE to say this car Horn wiring is non standard lol!

Just remembered something else:-

W2 Look at it, it isnt the same colour as the purple and black wire under the dash, looks more brown and black with a light on it Exclamation

Advice

OK Clive ...you're doing fine ( said Geoff from the shelter of a trench ...) now I want you to cut the ..... oops getting carried away with the bomb disposal analogy again ! Seriously though ...be careful about plugging in wires willy nilly ...there is / ought to be unswitched / 12v at c2 on that relay ...arc welder time if you're unlucky

Well what a mucking fuddle you've got there !

I'm looking forward to seeing the photograhs but here's a few more questions...

* what is w2 connected to ?
* what is connected to c2 ?
* as you have a brown wire from c1 to the horns what is/are the other wire (s) from the horns connected to ?...let me guess that it's brown and connects to the column contact

When we've seen the photos I'd still like to see / hear what happens when you connect w2 to earth with the ignition on

Geoff


----

Indeed ..... JN UPtons ,certainly did things different or they had just run out of wire of the correct colour

I have emailed you the pics, photobucket just isnt working todayit wont bring the uploader up for some reason I will post the pics ASAP

Advice

Clive, if you’re going to be doing a lot of work sorting out the electrics….STOP!

Disconnect the live lead from the battery, and reconnect with a single cable with in-line fuse of about 15 amps. You won’t be able to start the car, but in the event of putting a live feed across an unprotected circuit, you will prevent frying your loom, or at worst, setting the whole thing on fire. Shocked

I speak from (expensive) experience when re-wiring my Coupe Exclamation Sad

----

Horn relay, with spare wire at for front



Left hand horn OS



Right Hand NS



Horn Advice

OK Clive ...got the photos ...it's as I feared !

The P O has bypassed the relay .

He's used the Brown / Purple feed from Fuse 3 (50 amps) to c2 which he's just used as a convenient connection point to connect a brown wire to one terminal on 1 horn.

He's then connected a brown wire to the other terminal of the horn which, I'll now bet £10 is the brown wire under the column ...so he's using the delicate contacts in the column to switch full horn current to earth !

Also explains why the Purple / Yellow tracer is dangling freely by the relay & c1 is not used.

It's a long way of confirming that

* the relay isn't in circuit
* the column switch is fried

but we got there.

Just for fun he also seems to have run another wire to the other horn but not connected up it's second terminal ..unless it's hidden in the photo ... therefore the second horn isn't going to work at all.

Up to you of course but I'd be reinstating the correct wiring per Heuer's diagram , probably with a new relay .. all the usuals have them...& then tackling the column switch.

It does beg the obvious questions about the condition of the loom to the bonnet plug / socket & the whereabouts of the proper horns in the undertray area....or maybe the P O was just too lazy to replace a faulty relay ?

Take out F3 and you can work away with your meter in safety .

I'll be happy to sort it with you next week if you wish
Geoff


----

Geoff,

I'll answer this but see you have posted already and cracked the problem Wink
First of all the new office.... (Thank god for Wi-Fi)



Right to the questions:-

W2 - Runs into the loom, cant see a wire that colour behind the dash and after trying another of my new pilates positions couldnt see one under the steering column

C2 with the woven outer casing also goes in to the loom but one with the same characteristics comes out and is attached to the big dynamo...

C1 - Yes brown wire goes to the horn, front left. Front right Black wire this I could trace I think its like an earth comes back to this clip on the frame



Back left brown and Back right black are bound together and trail off to the other horn. Left is plugged in black is tapped back.

Thanks for your diagnostics Geoff

If its ok with you I'll get a horn relay ordered and anything else you may think I might need. Then if youre calling in one evening next week you can give me some pointers. I'll take some notes and crack on with it ASAP.

It does make me wonder how this got through its MOT the week before I bought it..... scratch

Maybe a case of Cheers to the MOT mechanic. Wink


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:42 am

P30

Oct 27, 2009

More Horn Fun


Advice

Hmmm ... have you had that cheap boroscope from the Sunday Times advert down your steering column then Clive ?...there a lot more to the horn switch than the rod, washer, spring & insulator shown in your earlier post

The slipring & associated cotacts are quite delicate

I'll e-mail you later

Geoff


----

No I havent I didnt realise it was a compulsory purchase lol!

Advice



You can check the operation of the horn push quite simply using a continuity tester so don't go diving in and dismantling things! All the parts 13 to 20 above are contained within the column 2 and some (16, 17, 18 ) are held in place by 19 and 20. These are the bits you do not want to mess with unless you really have to. The horns draw a high current but usually only for a short period. The relay is there to protect the column contacts from arcing which, over time, would cause a build up of carbon and prevent operation. It is highly unlikely bypassing the relay would cause failure in the short term. Your pictures show no traces of carbon, erosion or other evidence of high current which suggests those parts are OK. I had my column apart (for a different reason) and the horns directly connected for testing. Despite extended use whilst 'tuning' the horns I saw no evidence of the contacts getting even warm as everything is rated well in excess of requirements.

Your work so far has been inspirational to us all so please, now that winter is almost upon us, don't fall into the trap of deeply dismantling things. You will end up on a nine year restoration program (it always seems to be nine years ) and whilst it could be deeply satisfying life will have passed you by - think where YOU will be ten years from now. Stick with the rolling maintenance and enjoy the car. Owning an E-Type stuck in a garage kind of misses the point


Nov 02, 2009


I dont know about inspirational Embarassed Ive only done some basic jobs with a lot of help from other E Type enthusiasts like myself but who have a lot more knowledge I hope not to fall into this NYRP, but I do have a jobs planned for the winter, not necessarily in this order:

1) Replace rear hub inner and outer bearings
2) Rebuild front suspension, ball joints are shot and rubbers perished on wishbones.
3) Drain coolant, replace all hoses, drain taps, seal header and heating tank, polish engine parts coolant runs through, + cam covers etc
4) Oil change again replace rubber pipe from sump and change filter.
5) Radius Arm to replace

No doubt there will more but I wont be dropping IRS axles myself

Hopeful the jobs should get some forum interest Question

back to the horns, I dont think there is actually a problem with my Horns as they sound fine, I know there mounted in the wrong place but I think the wiring needs replacing first Exclamation

Comment

I sincerely meant the bit about being inspirational. You climbed out of an immaculate M5 and, with little experience of classic cars, got stuck into an E-Type. It is a perilous and rocky road and usually ends up with the aforementioned nine years in the garage or the ubiquitous "unfinished project". Stick with it, Forum members are delighted to help, and it is a pleasure to watch you succeed. All strength to you.

OK, come on now, group hug Exclamation


Nov 03, 2009

Horn Diagnosis

Ok, someone whos a bit of whizz at diagnosing erratic stutters called round tonight to help solve the horn issue

So after a quick we headed into the garage

As Id said before Id fitted the new relay. After wiring the new relay up we found it was actually easier to do after taking it off again, it saves standing on your head to see C1 C2 W1 W2. Which I believe the wires can be plugged onto the wrong spades if its attached to the car.

Anyway with the new relay loose and doing continuity checks on the relevant wires

C1 - Brown wire to the left horn and extended over to the second horn as should Smile
C2 - Braided wire should of had 12v when ignition was on this had it when the car was off. Turned out the dangling wire was the correct one. Smile
W1 - Green to the fuse Smile
W2 - Purple and brown this was continuous to the purple and black under the dash. No. Sad Ok, pick a colour, Brown , yes Smile
lets test the Brown Smile
Anyway with all these in the new relay and doing the click test the new relay didnt work. Sad

Tomorrow I will be on the phone to someone not a grin

After a few more tests we had both horns sounding not when hitting the correct horn button though Exclamation

Now using the old relay, why was it not in the circuit in the first place Question

Least now the horn is wired correct from the horns back to the earth connector on the steering column Smile

Now for the fun bit strip down the column and see whats missing good idea RTFM
Theres an incentive to get my column off looks like a job for next week, best get and get my bench cleared in the shed.

Some how I think I will doing a lot of on this one.

Be ready for the guide how to strip down the column
Nov 04, 2009

Horn Kit
Part No: SBS1280
E-type series 1

£52.60

For a couple of bits

Now to see if I can source one Exclamation



Best go and get my bench cleared in the workshop.

Some how I think I will doing a lot of :photoman: on this one.

Be ready for the guide how to strip down the column Wink

Question

I just have to ask are you married? If you are what is your secret to get so much Garage time? I know I spend six months of the year away at work but if I spend too much time in the garage when my wifes home I soon get ear ache. Fortunately she works during the week so on my 28 days off I get the garage while she's at work

----

Answer

Yes Happily married Cheers
My secret - my wive works in CASH (Contraception & Sexual Health) womens clinics etc (Just to clarify in CASH not "for CASH" ) Most of her clinics are in the evening so I get time to fettle spanner , plus she new what I was like when she married me if I wasnt tinkering with cars I was polishing them.
The deal is I keep my wkd toy as long as we can have nice holidays as she loves to travel, which now Ive got to addicted to as well. lol!


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Sat Dec 05, 2009 10:49 am

P31

Removal of the Upper Steering Column (USC)

Advice


It is dead simple to remove the column from the car. Remove the bolt from the u/j in the footwell and you should be able to extract the entire assembly, steering wheel and all. This is a great way to test things as you will have the complete unit. The only part that will stay with the column housing will be the contact #23 but if that has failed it will be obvious. Only thing to consider is removing the indicator cowls to make sure nothing snags as you extract the column. If it is a tight fit try easing the u/j open with a screwdriver. If you loosen the adjuster #9 and give the steering wheel a sharp pull it will accelerate forward, stop, and the momentum should bring the column out.

Whilst you are down there check the u/j is free to move - if not replace the bearings.


----

Nov 04, 2009

I love it when people say it's gonna be dead simple pale

Nov 08, 2009

Steering Column Removal & Stripdown


Ok, lets begin, first of all "DISCONNECT THE BATTERY" good idea

Quick picture of cockpit with horn push removed and steering wheeel nut loosened right off.



Horn switch rod out and all bits attached to it out.



Quick look under the column, after the brown wire had been removed from the bullet and tapped up and labelled and the stray prurple one just tapped up.



Then I removed the indicator stalk off the column I think some of the wire colours may be correct here Anyway got it tapped up out the way.



Remove nut an bolt from the UJ



Next, remove the nut and bolt and spacer tube to the upper bracket.



As soon as you do this the whole thing drops Shocked As you can see there is an old washer lurking in there. Exclamation



Pull towards you, and out she comes Smile
Not quite remove 1 UJ as someone said Rolling Eyes

With the patient in place Exclamation



Work on a piece of paper with the edges rolled up so you dont loose any parts Exclamation

Next I take the machette from the rack and start the delicate dissection, quick



By the way make sure you have circlip removers I didnt, but will get some for next week good idea

Take off the control striker this slid down the column after removing the two little bolts followed by removing the stop button





Then I quickly stripped down the Outer Tube Assembly this was very empty, there was one spring clip (rubber each end) a thinner one at the top heres the pics any way . This I will refurbish before re fitting.



Can grease on this contact be good Question







So according to this



With inner column and inner column male cleaned up, and all the parts tidy and a list of missing parts nearly complete..... 11 and counting No wonder this swear horn doesnt work



As you will see I havent removed the slip ring or the rotor assembley but looking up the end all you could see was straight through no No17 or 18



So that takes it to 13 parts missing

So my shopping list is :-

4 x No5
1 x No4
1 x No3
1 x No27
1 x No11
1 x No21
1 x No16
17 & 17 ?

Just before anyone asks no that isnt my Chinese order for tonight its the missing parts according to Haynes P241 Fig 11.39 (as above)

Horn Advice

You need to remove the slip ring 19 to get at 16, 17 and 18. The slip ring is a push fit so easy to get off but watch for the retained spring and nipple flying out. Remember this whole thing is just to mate 12 volts with the long brass contact pin 12. So:

12 contacts with 16
16 contacts with 19
19 contacts with 22
22 has 12 volts on it (your brown wire)

You should be able to get continuity with a meter from the brass slip ring to the brass contact pin. If you can it is working correctly. Remaining in my kit I have 19 and 18 but can't find 16/17 although I have not used them.

PS did you check the u/j for free movement? New ones have a grease nipple on them and are not expensive but make a huge difference to steering feel. If the top one is gone you should replace the bottom one as well. The kits re-use the existing yokes, just new needle bearings and shells.


----

More Advice

Umm ...not quite true .

For a +ve earth vehicle and assuming that all is correct contact-wise the horn pin 12 will measure at -12v using a very high impedance voltmeter whilst the horn push button is not being depressed. (If a cheap multimeter is used a current will be drawn through the relay coil & the -12v will drop partially across the coil & partially across the voltmeter.) It "sees" this -12v as it is effectively connected via w2 on the relay, then through the relay coil to w1 & thence to -12v on fuse F6.

The correct role of the horn pin 12 is to connect w2 to earth at the rear of the horn push itself when the push is pushed, causing current to flow through the relay coil, energising the main contacts & thus connect the horn common feed to -12v via the Purple / yellow ( or in Clive's case ..another blasted brown wire) from pin c1.

Geoff


Then a different Veiw

Err - polarity is of no relevance here nor indeed is the relay.

The various bits in the steering column are to create a road capable of carrying electricity to the horn button in light of the column having to rotate. With the assembly out of the car (see picture 9 above) all Clive needs to determine is the continuity of the circuit. A multimeter set to measure resistance or a simple continuity tester (bulb and 1.5v battery) attached to the slip ring and the other end to the tip of contact 12 should confirm whether it is working. In fact with the steering wheel/horn button back on the assembly, a tester attached to contact 23 and the other to a steering wheel spoke screw should produce a meter deflection or when the button is pressed - that Clive should be your final test before re-installing.

Your statement is 'technically' correct but it creates an air of mystery around simple car electrics, scares owners from attempting the work themselves so is not helpful.


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:58 pm

P32

Nov 08, 2009

USC \ Horn Repair


Took the Upper Mounting Bracket to refurb as well this afternoon, while doing turned the UJ, it seemed to spin fine, so I wont replace it will check the one at the other end of the column when sorting all parts required.

Horn Repair Kit

Will check in the morning THANKS for everyones comments.. Wink

Answer to last Comment (P31)

Thank you for your gracious acknowledgement that my statement is correct . It is usually helpful to start from such a postion.

There's no mystique here ...electrical wiring is just like plumbing with a source & a drain. Current flows along pipes (wires) from a higher position ( voltage or potential ) to a lower position (chassis/earth ) doing useful work along the way ....end of theory.

My first paragraph was written to tidy up sloppy terminolgy & my second was to clarify that the horn relay is actually earthed at the horn button ...a fact that escapes some folk.

Happily the restorers of Clive's car , who have given us hours of fun with this simple little circuit, seemed to appreciate this in that the horn push was wedged into the boss with crumpled up kitchen foil ...oh how we laughed last Tuesday night !

I'm also pleased that you've moved on from your earlier statement that "pin 12 looks ok so there will be nothing wrong in the column"

By the way polarity is pretty important when I'm trying to show Clive how to use his B & Q multimeter effectively, & without the irrelevant relay your 12v wouldn't appear on the purple / black ( brown ) wire under open circuit conditions.

We've actually made much more progress using a simple piece of wire to bridge various terminals to produce functionality.

I'm off to China for the week now but am looking forward to hearing working horns on my next visit to Clive's garage.

Keep up the good work with the forum
Geoff


----

So what is included in the horn kit Question



What I need Exclamation

1 x No27 - Insulating Strip - (cant see it on P31 Jpeg 8 or in kit, guys )
1 x No11 - External Circlip - Assorted box ordered from Wrights Auto Supplies (Matt)
1 x No21 - Insulating sleeve ( Bottom left in Jpeg )
1 x No16 - Insulating bush (middle of Jpeg like black liquirce allsort )
1 x No17 - Contact Nipple ( Horizontal little piece in Jpeg)
1 x No18 - Spring ( Small spring in Jpeg)
1 x No 19 - Rotor Assembly (The piece most left in Jpeg)
1 x No 20 - Slip ring (The piece most right in Jpeg)

Have an addition to my list No 26 - Insulating sleeve (The piece nearest the top in Jpeg )

Could someone confirm if my detection of parts is correct please

Also ordered my circlip pliers now

Hope to have everything for wedneday for re assembly - wed afternoon fingers crossed (icon needed).

Lower UJ well once I located it well I have never needed to look for it before. Anyway I took a picture of it



It does look a bit a dry so as the next job after my horn is to start on the front suspension rebuild we will do the bottom UJ, gaitors, and track rod ends, really I should call these steering work and not FS work but lets not deviate yet, lets keep focused on the horn.

Anyway quick couple of shots of part 1 OTA and part 37 UMB pre work

Hijacked potting shed smoker



Parts in the conservatory, you can tell Karens out Very Happy



Horn Advice

The brown square is the insulating strip #27 - you need to cut it to shape. The insulating bush #15 is the one deep in the column which I suggested you do not remove. The originals are white nylon and yours can be clearly seen through the elongated slot. You just need to ensure the side hole is aligned properly. The original rotors are in two parts, the repro is a single part, and as you correctly identify, on the left.

The order of assembly is:

1. Part 27 is pushed into the column with the side hole correctly aligned (can be the difficult bit - but yours seems to be in place).
2. The rotor is placed over the cut out on the column.
3. The contact nipple is dropped into the hole in the rotor
4. The spring is inserted in the hole
5. The slip ring is pushed on to retain the spring and nipple.
6. The long contact rod is pushed into the column and makes contact with the nipple.

The insulating sleeve #26 is just a bit of rubber tube to protect the wire joint. You could use a piece of insulating tape or buy a bag of insulators from Maplin.


Eventually found all the bits. This is the steering column and the various parts in the repair kit:



The large black bush (5 and white nylon originally) slides down the column from the right. The hole in the bush needs to be aligned with the hole in the column. The rotor (2) clips over the column and the black plug goes through the hole and into the bush. The brass nipple (3) fits into the black part of the rotor followed by the small spring (4). You will notice the spring has a 'hook' on the end which is important as it ensures a good contact with the brass ring (1). The brass contact ring (1) is pushed, serrated side last, onto the column from the left and over the rotor trapping the spring in place with the 'hook' ensuring there is a good contact.

The rest of the bits in the kit (6, 7, 8 and 9) are the two contacts and a couple of insulators. I have to say the two repro contacts are pretty useless as they are made of soft copper and do not have sufficient spring in them. Use the originals if you can.

So before you pull the column to bits any further put the long brass contact 12 in the column as see if you have a continuous circuit from the serrated ring to 12. If you do then look no further. If not your problem probably lies with the the spring or nipple.


----

Nov 10, 2009

Just going out to rebuild the column as parts have arrived

But re the horn kit SNGB £52.80 Exclamation

Hutsons who are ace charge a tad over £30.00 plus you dont get ripped off with silly postage charges, I ordered it about 12 yesterday and it was here about 9.30am today grin

Next all the parts are here I thought I'd cover all bases and order a mixed box of internal and external circlips from Wrights Auto Suppliers that arrived also this morning but didnt have one big enough. Hence I rang Matt and he is sending me a load of assorted big ones in an envelope. (FoC) grin

NB to the new guys, choose your suppliers well and build up a good rapport... Wink

So currently waiting on circlips till the morning and then also my indicator shrowd has had a paint reaction so complete refit is going to be put back a day. But least when it is parts 1, 9, 29 (shrowd) & 37 will all be a nice new gloss black Smile

Right out to the workshop

Quick :photoman: of paint reaction



Inner column in the vice ready for strip down



Gently open the teeth on the slip ring to remove, notice how there is a hole worn in it Perhaps this caused silver grease Question



With the slip ring off there is a spring swear



Followed by a nipple Wink



As a treat here is a picture of a pair of nipples..... hurray







As you can see the left is much shorter - worn down with age I dont know

Everthing else out the IC



Quick look at the kit



Insulating bush in and contact earth section assembled



I think this goes on the earth Question



So, putting the new back on, rotor assembly - make sure put it round the right way first time I did of course Embarassed



The grooved end goes to the right, then slide the slip ring over it holding the spring down with a side of a screwdriver. Dont let go of the spring before the slip ring is deffinately over it or it will ping into your workshop Embarassed again not that mine did. swear



Slightly lift the claws with a scewdriver and then when on and in position push them back in....

Then you should be left with this.



Spring to replace spring on rod and piece of hard paper to

Well I'll let you tell me that one, its deffinately not to make a roll up its to small

So with nearly everything back together obviously the IC and the IC male (ICM) arent connected back together.

But, I thought I would have ago with my rod so I pushed my rod (part 12) if youre following into the IC and I must say it was a nice tight fit you could feel something gripping it down the end Cheers

Calm down Clive, its not working in the car yet

Now Im waiting on a circlip, and the paintwork or it would of been back on tonight .....

Anyway Stella is calling me Im off for a deserved

Comments

Remember to put a smear of grease on the brass contact ring. Ideally it should be silicone grease but ordinary grease will work just as well - thin smear is all that is needed. Similarly run some grease (greasy hands) all over the entire shaft to keep rust at bay. Inner adjustable shaft needs to be well greased as well and a blob of grease on parts 33 will hold them in place when fitting up.

----

Great close-ups Clive.
Your mechanical expertise is awe inspiring.


----

Test

Did continunity test grin Passed Exclamation


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Mon Dec 07, 2009 1:52 am

P33

Nov 11, 2009

Pre USC Install


Heres the Indicator Assembly shroud ready for a respray after being striped down after the paint reaction.



Anyway got a bit of "mis en plas" done ready for the refit Wink

First of all make 2 high tech supports to hold the IC & MIC
Greased up with the newly painted OTA in the back ground still hardening off.



Control striker & Stop Button now fitted as well.

Thats a bout as far as we can go out in the workshop so off to the garage.

Noticed a strange silver thing under the dash Question Clues anyone Question



Out of interest I thought Id see if there was connection behind the dash with the brown wire connecting to the purple and black which comes from W2 on the Horn relay but unfortunately it was like a ferret down a hole....



UJs in the car it looks fine



But I good dose of grease on it and gave it a good twiddle (technical term that) Wink



Hardura on inner bulkhead needs attention , but thats a job for another day.... Whats the best thing to stick it down Question

The excess grease can be wipped off on the test drive with your work trousers or you can do it with a rag when the IC is re located.

NB. Please note the parts 33 arent on the ICM yet

Advice

Silver thing is Indicator flasher unit.

----

Horn Relay Question

I ordered horn relay and the one that has come is labelled up different and is a different shape (cylinder) not that, that matters...

From 12 o clock the spades are labelled 87, 85, 30/51, 86

I have all my wires on the old relay labeled W1, w2, c1, c2 for ease, which numbers on the new spades now mate up with the relavant wires Question

Now



New Relay



Horn Relay Answer

Relay information here:-

http://www.coolcatcorp.com/faqs/relays.html



Check back at my Bracket before the refurb



Notice any difference



Old relay labeled up, (above in HRQ) and new one fitted below



Now to the UJs, thought I may as well change as I dont know the age of them.

Right, I thought it was a case of undoing the bottom yoke and pulling it through into the drivers cockpit, no undo the top yoke and remove and you pull it the other way after removing the rad and the bonnet affraid

Hence, I have so far removed the top yoke and noted the position before removal so it lines up with the lower UJ when refitted.

Simply to remove, one nut and bolt tightening the yoke onto the spline, pull it towards you and its off. That is the easy bit....



Then the manual says something a bit like this

" take the UJ in one hand and hit lightly with a hide covered mallet"

Hit lightly my swear

Oops forgot remove those 4 circlips first, :photoman: please



So after that I was hitting points 1 & 2 with the flat part of an old screwdriver followed by a 1lb hammer without much happening. Part 3 is actually the bearings there like long rollers. 4 is the hole the bolt came from to tighten it on to the spline.



With cap off a bearing set, cylindrical bearings are now visable



I scrounged some circlips off the guys at John Gordons today Cheers when collecting my parts so refit is ready when the top UJ is done, I think the bottom will be done when the rad is out etc. No way to bring in through the drivers footwell hole to small, unless you know different Question

Lower Steering Column UJ (LSCUJ) Advice

Managed to do mine without dismantling things further. With the upper steering column out there is enough room to move the lower column backwards to allow the u/j to be removed. Using Hex sockets and a vice - pressing the caps out is the best way. Reverse the method for putting them back in.

----

Nov 13, 2009

LSC Upper UJ Removal

Unfortunately my vice doesnt open far enough to do the two socket removal process so I came up wth this process.

A few pictures below to easily follow:-









Grind off the rough edges and it should make the new UJ easier to slide back in. That will be another story lol!



What you get after the strip down



Then you know me, I like to put it back together better than it was Smile

So I found a tin of VHT Matt Black Enamal Paint........



The one on the left seems to have dried PDQ

So what we have to fit when they are properly dry.



Even though the chap on the phone told me I would be getting sealed units Im happy I got the nippled version, as this is a of a job and I think I will be happier greasing the nipples than changing these UJs every so often. Just have to make sure I put the nipple side the right way so I can access the nipple

Also once this is back together and fitted to the spline I will release the other end, pull the column into the cabin as far as possible cover everything and paint the LSC as far as I can before the big re assemble

Now what was it I started off doing Oh yes repairing the horn. Horn

You should see my list for January, Im initally draining the coolant to change the hoses but with that out I have so many other jobs to do linked to that....

The car will deffinately be off the road for all January.


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Thu Dec 10, 2009 3:28 am

P34

Nov 20, 2009

USC UJ Rebuild & USC Install


So with the USC UJ stripped down, time to rebuild it after the painting with the Matt Black VHT Paint.

Heres plenty of pics I know some of you are doing this over the winter



A big vice is really needed to squeeze the sliding joints over the well greased bearings



Use a socket to squeeze them right home before putting the internal circlips on





After a lot of squeezing it's a much nicer looking and freely moving UJ



Now fitted and the LSC painted as well Smile



With that Upper Mounting Bracket refurbed



I think some cable management system is rquired under there Exclamation

What do you guys use Question

Next, rebuild the OTA



Part 23 is upside down here but I have now turned it.



Put the spring clips back in the OTA
NB. The fat one goes at the bottom

For your Ref.



Put the Male USC inside the Female USC then slip the FUSC in the OTA



NB. Making sure it doesnt slip down I'll tell you why later

Next screw part 9 the lock nut on



Followed by the circlip, I scrounged from John Gordon



Next -add 1 steering wheel Wink



Steering wheel in place and washer in place

Dont think I mentioned Id put the the control sriker on and screwed in with my fingers the stop button Exclamation



From the workshop to my tiny garage

First two bolts in the OTA and part 38 Lower Mounting Bracket, when you push your FUSC in make sure the end shaft is correct so you get your bolt through for the UJ



Connect the horn while youre down there and what I'm doing now is labeling every wire I touch
I know whats it far as the colours mean nothing on my car.... Exclamation

Do they Geoff Question



So then you have this



Look at that paint work go back a page or two and check how it was Very Happy

Then remember that little spring washer I found on the right



It was from the bolt that holds the indicator stalk on

Steering wheel in nut on



Geoff, If you reading this "LOOK AWAY" for the next picture or dont laugh Exclamation Exclamation Laughing Laughing



The Horn button was too small for the replica wheel so I had to improvise.
I will obviously have to get a new steering wheel when I get back working again Exclamation
Dont forget a good dob of grease at the top of the horn button on the inside

So with the horn button back in place and after wiggling it about a bit, I pressed the button and Horn Horn

With the horn working and not having not had a car for about 2 weeks I took her out for a good spin

Now for the bad news....... No, nothing like that

Shes back in the garage.

But before setting off I realised I couldnt pull the steering wheel out swear

I now realise what has happened swear

Go to "Lessons Learnt" for an explanation Exclamation

I'd just like to say a big for everyones input on this Very Happy


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Thu Dec 10, 2009 5:06 am

Tidying Up the Engine Frames

After messing with my relays and chasing wires to the Horns my wiring was a looking a right mess



The actual picture frame wiring wont get sorted till the old fan, coolant tank etc comes off in
Jan see "Jobs to be done"



But after being pointed in the direction of

http://moutons.org/Jaguar/Photos/Details/

Some of the pics in the slide show were useful to give me direction Smile

After getting a Loom cable clip and strap set from John Gordon

I set to work...





Now Ive done that I see the battery needs coming out and a good sort out down there Shocked

Least its a start...


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Tue Jan 05, 2010 1:17 am

Well Happy New Year Everyone hurray

Once the snow has melted in Lancashire I am going to get on with my list of jobs in the Newsletter that went out before Xmas. I was hoping for a last drive but out side my house its like an Ice ring so not a good conditions for a rear wheel drive car. Sad

As nearly all work to be carried is under the bonnet I need better access so I dont have a bad back while freezing working in my garage Exclamation

I saw this link on Jag Lovers:-

Right click the link and select Arrow Open in new window

http://www.jag-lovers.org/snaps/snap_view.php3?id=1232319379

To make life easier I want my bonnet to open vertical, so when the snow melts and I can get in my workshop I will make some 4" stands so the bonnet will open 90 degrees after removing one lot of split pins each side from the balancing springs.


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Mon Jan 11, 2010 3:43 am

welcome

After reading a thread on JL written by Rick , saying he was working on his car in his cold garage in Houston. I got the bug to do some work on my project even though its freezing out...

On going out to my workshop I saw the chimenea and decided to light it for some warmth



I think the neighbours thought I was mad scratch

Anyway, I got my pair of stands made so that the car will be 4" higher off the ground at the front so the bonnet will open..

Im no master carpenter but heres one of them Smile



Just need it to warm up a few degrees so the engine will be ok without anti-freeze in, as I need it to be out for a few weeks he he


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Sun Jan 17, 2010 4:02 am

New Rear Number Plate Fitted

I had to get the E Type out today. (only on to the drive)

So I could tidy my garage, when I put the car back in I fitted the new rear plate what a difference.

Arrow Before:-



Arrow After:-



A bad picture which I will replace later, but I think you'll agree, it looks a lot better grin


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Fri Jan 29, 2010 4:27 am

Getting the E Ready for 2010 Fetteling to Commence

Well this was a fun job in itself, anyway its all done now so I thought I'd grab a and do an update.

So I actually need the car raised slightly so I can fully open the bonnet, as I dont have the room to store it as my garage is only a couple of feet longer the car and 8' 6" wide ViolinsOut

Anyway, after making my blocks to stand the front wheels I got the car in place with extra axle stands underneath at the front.



After moving the Trolley and putting it away and looking alround at the jobs I have to do I realized that I wouldnt get the front ARB off with the wheels on scratch hence the car is now on stands swear



Next I disconnected the Bonnet Tension Springs and opened the bonnet fully and secured it at the top just incase good idea I dont want it falling my head Exclamation



Right Arrow "Let the Cat see the Rabbit" Laughing


OS Arrow Suspension to be completely refurbed, old girling shocks to be relaced with Boges, re-route rest of loom, bellows and track rod ends replace, Front ARB refurbish




OS Rad Veiw Arrow Horn wiring sort out, Bonnet hinge refurb, header tank seal in side, header tank and bracket, and fan cowl respray, new coolcat fan and otter and relay to fit.



NS as OS -Here you can also see the bottom the bonnet pan that needs slight attention this will be done when Ive finnished all my work.



NB Girling shocks are fine but just being replaced will be going in my garage Clearout thread if you want first refusal make me an offer Wink

NS again -Brake will be my first upgrade -They have had full overhall in previous threads..



Rad Hoses all being replaced thats why Im dropping the Coolant Arrow it will be out 3-4 wks I hope thats ok Question
If its not and it gets cold I'll have to get some heating in the garage Exclamation



Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Sat Jan 30, 2010 5:01 am

Removal of Radiator & Front Anti Roll Bar (ARB)

My goal this afternoon was to get the front ARB off.
It has always annoyed me with all the red paint on it.



I'd done some work down in this region in the summer last year, Goodridge Braided Hoses, Changing the bushes etc, new drop links etc.

Firstly the coolant was dropped:-



Disconnected the hose to the top of the Rad, loosened it with a pointed item





Once off took off the nut and bolt holding the bracket and a few other nuts and bolts underneath.
Then the hose came off bottom right, another job to the list refurb the pipe between the two hoses.
I was communicating with Mark (theetypeproject) this evening, he was saying the more you take
apart the more jobs you find, hes deffinatley right Smile



I already have a new set of braided hoses to go on, plus some new Brass Drain taps he he



So with rad out I got it out side and flushed it through



Then got it in the workshop as it will need some attention a nice coat of POR 15



So with the Rad out, it was time to look into the front great



I couldnt believe the size of the little fan, no wonder they have a reputation of over heating.

The picture also shows the horns (in the wrong place) not had the headlamps out to see if the originals
are in there, header tank bracket which is being done, steering rack, coolant bend, bit of paintwork and
fan shrowd all which will be done.

At this point the Mrs. came home so worked stopped, hope to get some more done over the wkd. spanner

Parts list for Hutsons has started already Smile

All in all a goodjob


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:33 am

ARB Removal Cont.

Getting everything out so the front ARB can be removed is not a 5min job.
By the time you have dealt with all the rusty bolts etc

First job today was to remove the radiator fan cowl, then I took the old Otter Switch out of the Radiator Header Tank (RHT).



This is to replaced when being rebuilt by the Coolcat Otter Switch

http://tinyurl.com/5nla7

With the RHT out I could see all rubbers were perished and needed replacing, I think they'd been there since new Sad



The Mrs came in with a and grabbed my



Some Articles about the cooling system can be found here

http://www.jaguarmk10420gsymposium.com/e-type-parts-problems-f6/interesting-cooling-problems-facts-t173.htm#281


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Tue Feb 02, 2010 3:16 am

Strip Down

With the RHT next thing was the HT Bracket.



With that out the way I could access this pipe work



Once removed I got a quick picture so I remembered how it went back together, the angled pipe is currently being refurfed in the workshop Wink



Next off with the horns, which are in the wrong place but werent working when I got the car but after the USC strip down and new relay work fine goodjob
High tech brackets holding them on Embarassed



One of the horns Arrow looks like the fan had been hitting it when first fitted Shocked



Next out with the original fan motor,(again to be replaced with a Coolcats Fan) sat above in the :photoman: Looks like it wasnt removed when the car was resprayed from its original OSB Arrow Carmen Red. Somewhere between 25\09\62 and 1978



Traced the wiring back to the loom, this was fitted about 2000 really needs replacing but funds dont permit at the moment.



So with all this out the way access to the ARB was clear grin





So out it came Arrow Heres the offending item





Again when the car was re-sprayed it wasnt removed or masked swear

This what came out to get to the Front ARB



Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Wed Feb 03, 2010 5:41 am

Refurbing Parts

Just a few shots of whats being refurbished etc.... :photoman:

Alot of parts are being done with POR 15 - Gloss Black



My ebay bargain New Boge Front Dampers have had a coat or two



Dont know if this picture fully captures what I was hoping to show but the nut there has at some stage rubbed against the loom - luckily it hasnt created to much damage I will secure it after checking its all safe and binding it with tape.



A part nearly got away, the radiator stonegaurd.





The picture frame has seen better days



I also sorted the section of the bonnet where there was no underseal this afternoon, this was it before:-



Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:50 pm

The Radiator

Here WiP -



Finnished Pics needed to follow.


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:58 pm

Update

With the initial reason of dropping the coolant to change the hoses and refurb the F. ARB now done Arrow Click Me Arrow Right Click select Open in New Window Wink

Now I find the only thing thing left on the Picture Frame is the Non PAS Steering Rack, not wanting this to look out of place, "Tatty".
When the car goes back to gether its being refurbed as well. good idea

Click Me Arrow Right Click select Open in New Window Wink

I look forward to any comments you have on that thread type


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:30 am

Changing some Coolant Hoses

The first hoses I tackled were looking like they were deffinatly on there last legs Crying or Very sad



The top one was removed first to give me access to the one beneath



Also coming off was the one the other end to this on the other end of the water pump return pipe.



The distributor cap was uncliped and held out of place to give me better access. I have had made a S/S water pump return to pipe but I couldnt get my hands in to undo the the nuts and bolts on the brackets so that will be a job for when this side of the engine comes off . RTFM Indeed Exclamation Exclamation

So with the first two pipes replaced.



The third one was a pigofajob to get off swear

Once it was off I found the pipe in the kit to large, so I noticed there is another pipe like it on the air filter trumpets so I have cut it so I can replace that as well.
(A. Nother job for the list)



Heres the pipe:-



The water pump I also noticed was looking sorry for itself - chipped etc.
So I gave it a coat of VHT and once I'd done that all the pully wheels on the front of engine then looked odd so I did those
then when I did the Dynamo pully wheel -yep you guessed it the dynamo itself got a coat.
So the last hose will go back on when all that is dry.

In the mean time while that was drying I went to the work shop to do some spraying idea2

Radiator Header Tank (RHT) & Components in Hammerite Silver Finish

So heres the RHT this morning temporary spray booth set up again lol!



Its getting 3 coates of spray - here it is after 2 but will need turning etc



Off to give it another coat


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Tue Feb 23, 2010 9:31 am

Waterpump Hose

The water hose at the front end of the water pump return pipe was a swear to get off, in the end I got it off and fitted the new one after stretching the end a bit before attaching it; heres some pics.



New S/S hose clips Wink



Dizzy cap back on



Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Wed Feb 24, 2010 8:09 am

Radiator Duct Shield

This was an under car car :photoman: of the sheild when I got the car awman



Overhead veiw of the new one fitted and refurbished today great



When i say refurbished they come as a plain piece of steel Ive given it a few coats of
POR 15 Smile


Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:47 am

VHT on Pulley Wheels

At the moment my car awaits the Steering rack to go back on hopefully this week end it will go back on the mounts which are already in place



All the pully wheels at the front of the engine have had a coat of VHT matt black, the timming plate still needs a clean with POR 15 Marine Clean



When changing some more pipes I side tracked onto re-routing the loom, after re routing the starter cable, I got onto the loom, but for easier access I removed the air filter case and plenum. The pipe from the breather at the front of the cylinder head goes into the crankcase device that goes to a rubber hoser hose that goes to another metal pipe which connects to the air intake trumpets


Even though mines a September '62 on the early models a pipe drops straight down through the engine, my metal pipe looked a bit tatty so Ive removed it to respray it good idea



Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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PostSubject: Re: Baselining - 369 HBF - 860871 - Before the Upgrades   Mon Mar 01, 2010 9:40 am

Hoses from Reservac Tank for Brake Servo & Air Balance Pipe

Gradually getting through the hose kit in between other jobs great

This is a bit of knuckle scrapping job as one end of each of the pipes goes on to the check valve assembly on the reserve tank. pullhair Nice and tricky to get the new pipe on Exclamation

Old pipes in place.



With the one new pipe on the other still to be fitted.



Next the new hoses are fitted making sure the correct hose is attached to the correct place
one going to the Servo and the other the Air Balance Pipe on the Engine.



Clive
1970 4.2 420G -17th from last RHD -Reggie
1970 4.2 420G -13th from last RHD -Ronnie
Symposium Enquiries to The Global Team  Arrow info@lancashireclassicjaguarhire.co.uk
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